Batman V Superman Discussion Part 4 General Thoughts and Miscellaneous

This was written several years ago on another site and has been reposted with some updates to the writing.

Batman V Superman Discussion Part 1 Recap Part 1
Batman V Superman Discussion Part 2 Recap Part 2
Batman V Superman Discussion Part 3 Characterization
Batman V Superman Discussion Part 4 General Thoughts and Miscellaneous

The Movie in General

I like this movie overall. I think it’s good but suffers in a few places and that its predecessor Man of Steel is better because of that. The main issue is that it tries to do too much. This is a very dense 2.5 hours, it does a lot for its own plot and for future movies. I think that this should have been two movies.

I’m not sure what I’d move to a second movie exactly but cramming everything in leaves some parts feeling shortchanged. I think we could have used some Lex flashbacks, maybe a bit more on Batman’s past like I mentioned and give the movie some breathing room. I question if this is where we should have had Doomsday, but if we cut him, I’m not sure what we would have had in place of him for a threat to unify Batman and Superman. The movie feels like three stories that are close to slotting together but don’t perfectly fit. However, despite its flaws I still like it.

Comments on Specific Scenes:

The Batman Nightmare

I’m torn on this scene, it’s very clearly hinting at Darkseid attacking Earth. It shows the omega symbol and parademons but we’re not shown why Batman would have this knowledge. I feel like it might have been intended for a future movie but didn’t happen. I think that we either needed more or less here.

The incident in the desert and Jimmy Olsen

Apparently, the CIA agent killed near the start of the film is Jimmy Olsen. This is confirmed in the credits and apparently scenes added in the extended cut. Here’s the thing: I don’t care. First off, nothing against the character of Jimmy Olsen but I’m kind of meh on him. Second off, this doesn’t feel like Jimmy Olsen at all, he’s just some guy the movie itself in front of me does nothing to establish him so it honestly doesn’t feel like it was Jimmy to me. It’s just some guy. I will admit this decision feels weird and mean spirited, but I think it was just a joke in the credits.

The Parallels

Watching this film this time I noticed a number of parallel scenes for Batman and Superman. First the film opens with the Waynes’ funeral and ends with Clark and Superman’s. Then there are the two different standoffs with the Warlord and Lois, and the merc and Martha, both with the women being threatened and both heroes diving forward to save them.

A Note on Tone.

Comparing the DC movies to the Marvel movies is inevitable and it’s fair, they’re in the same genre coming out at the same time. The DC movies have a much darker tone, and I get why people may prefer the tone of the Marvel movies, but I think the DC movies get unfairly dismissed.

For this comparison I keep coming back to Thor Ragnarok. I loved that movie, but I think it’s weaker than it could be. Thor Ragnarok feels like the end goal of the Marvel movie formula and in my opinion shows the weakness in it. The movie feels terrified of being serious leading to it constantly sacrificing tension or emotion to make a joke. It undermines itself and feels shallow. I would love to just have had a conversation between Loki and Hel or Odin and Hel, I would love some flashbacks to her childhood. I’d love anything that made Hel more than “look at me, I’m the sexy lady with a bunch of spikes”. Further I would really love for Bruce Banner’s heroic sacrifice to not have been turned into a punch line where we laugh at his corpse.

I wouldn’t want every movie to be dark movies but I like having something that has consequences to actions, we don’t have Tony conveniently buying a building right before fighting Hulk in it, we don’t have Tony getting off scott free from almost destroying the planet with Ultron and we don’t have Scott Lang only getting house arrest after being involved in a terrorist attack. Superhero battles have casualties, they have destruction, they have real effects, and I appreciate the DC movies at least trying to explore it.

I do admit they could have done it better it feels like they cut off right before they really got to the meat of the issue in the movie.

Ayn Rand

Ok, I feel like I need to acknowledge this at least. So, I've never read anything by Rand and have no interest in doing so. I've seen a lot of comparisons to this film and Rand's writing and from what I understand it does reference the themes of Atlas Shrugged. However, it's my understanding that Rand basically says to be selfish and not help others which is very much not the message of this film. From my understanding of the film, it examines that philosophy and ultimately rejects it in favor of doing good and helping people.